MarketThoughts.com Home Page
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups  StatisticsStatistics   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Europe's Stress Tests
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    MarketThoughts.com Forum Index -> The Europe Board
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Europe's Stress Tests
HenryTo
Site Admin
Site Admin


Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 11734
Location: Los Angeles, California

PostPosted: Sun Sep 27, 2009 12:13 am    Post subject: Europe's Stress Tests Reply with quote

The European Union will release its own version of the stress tests in the next few days. Early estimates put the total 2009 and 2010 banking losses to be about €400 billion, or US$580 billion. Note that the IMF will also release its "Financial Stability Review" this Wednesday:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/26/business/global/26banks.html?adxnnl=1&ref=global&adxnnlx=1254031609-d3tDdhlmKWPOp4NYXrVQdQ
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Post new topic   Reply to topic    MarketThoughts.com Forum Index -> The Europe Board
Author Europe's Stress Tests Replies
HenryTo
Site Admin
Site Admin


Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 11734
Location: Los Angeles, California

PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Obviously, the European stress tests didn't work too well--insofar as they were trying to prevent further mass deleveraging. IMF anticipating a sale of $2.6 trillion in bank assets by the end of next year unless further equity injections are made into European banks.

http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/00078672-8952-11e1-bed0-00144feab49a.html#axzz1sSj0FmgV
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
rffrydr
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 16932
Location: Sunny California

PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Of course the unintended consequences of putting safety first is that everything else becomes endangered. These results from SocGen showcase the grand dump of dollar assets 2H 2011...and go a long way towards explaining the "conundrum" relative strength of the euro.

http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2012/02/16/884311/a-fistful-of-legacy-dollars-at-socgen/


_________________
Today is the Tomorrow you worried about Yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rffrydr
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 16932
Location: Sunny California

PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And guess where this money is going? Euro-bank deposits:

http://blogs.wsj.com/marketbeat/2011/11/10/heres-one-reason-the-euro-hasnt-gotten-crushed/?mod=WSJ_qtoverview_wsjlatest
_________________
Today is the Tomorrow you worried about Yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rffrydr
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 16932
Location: Sunny California

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Really?!

http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2011/10/27/713866/but-what-does-mrs-watanabe-think/

Isn't this just proving the opposite? This is a good example of the kind of "blind rage" that comes of hysteria. Of course the double-pincer effect that got us here in the first, after a sprinkling of leverage, was entirely unforeseen--by the models. Twisted Evil
_________________
Today is the Tomorrow you worried about Yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rffrydr
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 16932
Location: Sunny California

PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, forgot.....it's ALL the sovereign debt which must be marked to market:

http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2011/10/19/706651/gilt-stuffed-and-shrinking-euro-banks-capital-hole/
_________________
Today is the Tomorrow you worried about Yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rffrydr
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 16932
Location: Sunny California

PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's not the banks (for the most part). It's the union--the unity.
_________________
Today is the Tomorrow you worried about Yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
HenryTo
Site Admin
Site Admin


Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 11734
Location: Los Angeles, California

PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bridgewater on Europe's stress tests:

Quote:
What a Good European Stress Test Should Look Like

There have been two prior European banks stress tests, neither of which was successfully executed. Both stress tests failed because they were not stressful enough to be credible, largely because they ignored the probability of peripheral sovereign defaults and did not stress bank funding much at all. Dexia's recent collapse after passing the stress test in July is just one example of the holes in the recent process. A credible test for European banks should not only provide transparency but also have stressful economic conditions translate to losses on banks' trading books and banking books, including their sovereign holdings. And, crucially, a credible means of quickly capitalizing banks that fail must be available to plug capital shortfalls if private sector capital is not available. Only then do we think that bank funding conditions will improve.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
rffrydr
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 16932
Location: Sunny California

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The "FT" effect:

http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2011/10/12/700706/is-there-such-a-thing-as-the-ft-effect/
_________________
Today is the Tomorrow you worried about Yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rffrydr
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 16932
Location: Sunny California

PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This would be comical if it weren't so painful. Moody's "surprise" downgrades Brit banks on account of no (more) govt. backstop while govt. owned RBS gets dragged into new EU stress tests--which, because one size doesn't fit all, it will fail BY DEFINITION.

This is just the viscous loop described right here in MT in '08 brought to bear once again. This time however we (are supposed to) know better. Yet these institutions clank right along pushing their own small gears as if it was they alone were the motor pushing the ship.

Shorting Hedge Funds may really have their eye's on the forced rights offerings--which govts (pensions?), like already seen in Ireland, will eventually join and feast on the all the dead capitalists. I'll be there too if it happens.

Quote:
RBS fared poorly, driven largely by the test’s one-size-fits-all methodology.
We just can’t see an 80% government-owned bank, which possesses an
£8bn contingent capital facility and a government backstop over most of its
riskiest assets injecting yet more capital based on a flawed test, just to
participate in a Europe-wide recap.


Quote:
BS reported an 11.1% CT1 ratio at 1H11, but under July’s EBA’s stress
test approach, the stress core tier 1 fell to 6.3%. This was above the 5%
hurdle rate applied in the test, but lower than where the banks would like
to be. Barclays, HSBC and LBG printed stress CT1s on the same basis of
7.3%, 8.5% and 7.7% respectively.
BE
There are several reasons why RBS appeared weak in the EBA test: (1) The
starting definition of core capital used was more stringent than Basel 2, the
deduction of securitisation positions bein the biggest adjustment, taking
starting CT1 down by 100bps; (2) The use of historic trading revenues for
future revenue generation. Given disastrous charges taken by RBS in the
crisis, assumed to recur in the stress, RBS comes about £5bn in revenues
short in the test, another 80bps of CT1; (3) The test excluded income from
businesses to be sold under the EU state aid provisions. Principally this is
RBS Insurance, reducing capital by about another £700m, 15bps. Adding
these up, sees the stress CT1 about 210bps lower than it perhaps should
be, plausibly taking stress up to 8.4% from 6.3%.
BE
RBS has £8bn contingent capital and APS backstop with the UK govt
RBS fared poorly on EBA’s test, but the methodology has obvious problems, one of the major reasons why a EuroTARP driven by EBA examination
is difficult to envisage for stronger banks like RBS and Commerzbank. Remembering that RBS has an £8bn contingent capital facility with the UK
government (contributed at 50p/share if CT1 prints sub 5%), Asset Protection Scheme coverage over £168n in assets, and that 80%+ of the increased
capital would have to come from government, we think the risks of an EBAimposed recap are modest.


I've stayed away so far mainly 'cause the "good" stuff did not come down to even the May 2010 levels. And some, Dexia, are just deathtraps. But Santander Preferred, for example, are just 25% off par.
_________________
Today is the Tomorrow you worried about Yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rffrydr
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 16932
Location: Sunny California

PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RBS's take via Alphaville:

The publication of the EBA stress test results last Friday provided a wealth of useful information to the market, increasing the transparency of the banking system in Europe. But we are of the view its role in the broader context of the current debt crisis is secondary and less relevant than the first stress-test release.
The key point is that the banking system in Europe has some pockets of weakness, but the crisis has reached a truly systemic stage as the once widely accepted view that contagion would be limited to small countries has proven to be a false hope.
NH
This week the market’s focus will be on the upcoming EU summit, scheduled for Thursday, 21 July.
Recently we argued that the situation is likely to continue deteriorating, to the extent that the entire euro area will be threatened. We believe the recent stresses in the EGB market have galvanised opinion sufficiently for a policy response. However, we do not expect this response to be the one that would turn sentiment for a sustained period. Indeed, we believe the EU summit to be almost solely targeted at Greece rather than at the whole system.
NH
Still, we think a more innovative and forceful response on Greece will likely be treated favourably by risk markets as it could lead to a significant reduction in its debt to GDP, something markets have been begging for some time.
However, we are treating this upcoming policy announcement in the same way that we dealt with the Greek parliamentary vote; we expect a short-lived positive effect on confidence.

The market currently expects the details of the new deal for Greece to include a combination of buybacks, new loans, loan interest rate cuts and PSI, with some of these initiatives consistent with a Greek debt downgrade to SD or D by rating agencies.
NH
A policy announcement centred on Greece that bring about a notable debt/GDP decline in an orderly fashion is likely to be seen as positive from the investors’ perspective because it will boost expectations that the Greek fiscal dynamics are more viable in the medium term. Such an announcement would also have positive externalities for other countries, especially Ireland and Portugal. For example, a clearing price for any rollover / debt exchange etc. will be interpreted as a floor for other countries given that Greece is widely seen as the worst country, and we do not expect aggressive treatment here.
NH
In the event that an announcement addressing Ireland and Portugal (in line with prospective Greek relief) is delivered at the same time on Thursday this will also be seen as a positive as it signals that Europe is starting to address the issues in a more systemic and holistic fashion. Taken together, this is likely to have positive spill over effects for Spain and Italy, at least in the near term.
Focus instead on the regime shift of just what it means to invest in EGBs – this points to a crisis that will get much worse
The elephant in the room however is the insistence by a number of countries that the private sector should take some of the burden via the Private Sector Involvement (PSI). It is at this time unknown just how this will be executed1 and the amounts that are likely to be saved via the PSI look moderate (with talk of near €20 bn) but the key facts remain that this would be a landmark signal that
NH
That core EMU is not willing to provide a benevolent lender attitude to Europe’s problems
RBS Research & Strategy | 18 July 2011


The politics of core EMU countries has turned to a protection their own very narrow domestic fiscal impacts and electoral concerns

If any country needs external funding assistance then haircuts (whether defined as voluntary or not) are integral to the solution.
It is the latter point that is likely to see the debt markets in larger periphery countries such as Spain and Italy worsen on a trend basis. Put simply, we do not believe that the market can stabilise around the view that the probability of a bailout requirement in either case will be static or lower given long lived concerns on issuance absorption, weak growth, ambitious budget targets, domestic financial fragility, political fragility, and the numerous contagion channels from what is still likely to be a high default risk in Greece

_________________
Today is the Tomorrow you worried about Yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rffrydr
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 16932
Location: Sunny California

PostPosted: Sun Jul 17, 2011 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And they have...and they're all over the map. "Transparency" is a myth. Lehman was an asset right up to the minute it was a liability. US Stress tests worked insofar as they put numbers on what was a black hole of fear.... although Roubinni/Whitney had other ideas later.
_________________
Today is the Tomorrow you worried about Yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
HenryTo
Site Admin
Site Admin


Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 11734
Location: Los Angeles, California

PostPosted: Sat Jul 16, 2011 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Morningstar on the latest European bank stress tests:

http://news.morningstar.com/articlenet/article.aspx?id=387355

Quote:
We think the most interesting part of the stress test lies not in the headlines but in the details. Once again, the stress tests did not include the potential impact of a sovereign default. While we see this as a flaw--the possibility of a sovereign default is one of the most important questions currently facing investors--we understand the political difficulties of including it. Importantly, the EBA results include detailed figures that quantify the sovereign debt holdings of each financial institution by country, as well as private debt holdings disclosed by type and country. We think this will make it relatively easy for investors to make the necessary calculations. For example, Deutsche Bank (DB) holds net EUR 5.3 billion in Italian sovereign debt and has EUR 40 billion of other loans there. A large negative shock in Italy would quickly consume a large chunk of the bank's EUR 30 billion of common equity.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
rffrydr
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 16932
Location: Sunny California

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2011 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A fringe party from Finland--talk about left-field. It's hard, sometimes really hard. But someone will get this in front of them in any case:

http://www.economist.com/node/18560535?story_id=18560535
_________________
Today is the Tomorrow you worried about Yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rffrydr
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 16932
Location: Sunny California

PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SocGen results, on the heels of Barclay's, reminding the market that these institutions are too big NOT to own. Evolution's markup as per Alphaphille:
Quote:

Our view is that the industry still faces significant challenges in achieving this transformation, particularly those firms with weaker, mid-tier IB franchises where balance sheet has traditionally been their sole source of competitive advantage. Fundamentally we continue to prefer diversified businesses and/or those with entrenched market share advantages in areas that are less challenged by Basel III ie equity and advisory. Both UBS and CS fit these criteria best, in our view…
JC
Nonetheless, in the event the market simply reprices all IBs to somewhere closer to book value the following table shows the theoretical upside with IB divisions valued at 1x. Amongst the biggest potential winners we highlight RBS (30% upside, rated BUY), CS (16%, rated BUY) and DBK (14%, rated SELL). After yesterday’s rally BARC now screens bottom of the list on this basis (-27%). At 1.5x (perhaps consistent with 15% ROE, 10% COE) the upsides would increase to 48%, 44% and 58% respectively.

_________________
Today is the Tomorrow you worried about Yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rffrydr
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 16932
Location: Sunny California

PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Olivetree update to "save europe" conference this week:

EUROPEAN BANKS – EU Stability Fund – A key weekend – we remain cautious



– EU Leaders meet this weekend to flesh out discussions on the stability fund – market has seemingly priced in a positive resolution.
– Market seems to be pricing in following:
* EFSF able to disburse full E440b (rather than c.E250b currently) due to additional guarantees.
* Ability for stability fund to help countries buy back debt allowing Greece to potentially reduce debt burden.
* Reduction in debt costs for Ireland (5.8%) and Greece (5%) allowing greater fiscal flexibility.
* Potential for EFSF to provide credit lines direct to countries and providing Portugal with stability funds.
* Tougher fiscal policy rules set for Eurozone.
– Considering that EU Banks rallied 11% from January lows, outperforming the market by 7.5% we think alot of the potential announcements priced in.
– In particular with the sector on 8x 2012 EPS and 1.1x TBV facing downgrades across Southern Europe, higher wholesale funding costs and higher capital requirements we believe the valuations are not as attractive as they initially appear and would be wary of being dragged into the current rally.

_________________
Today is the Tomorrow you worried about Yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message

Please log in to view without the ad banners
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    MarketThoughts.com Forum Index -> The Europe Board All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB